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Next Economy: What is it, What enables it

Page history last edited by Tom Brown 6 years, 8 months ago

Conveners: David Armistead

Note takers: Ben Grieser and Dave Sanford


The New Economy – Rules and Tools

Aesthetics of the New Economy


Ben's notes:


Part I: Key understandings, outstanding questions and observations


Creating a new economy will require a set of tools and rules, many of which still need to be developed. Most of the tools discussed centered on trust. Ideas and observations about trust-based tools include:

Do we actually need currency, or do we really just need exchange?

Trust itself can be a basis for exchange.

An unhackable reputation system could extend trust around the world.

Pseudonymity could be effective for creating reputation and fostering exchange.

Is it trust, or is a lack of fear what we really need?

Other tools discussed focused on messaging:

We need to develop a message which will introduce the new economy to the general public.

We also need to do a better job of informing the general public about the old economy.


Part II: Discussion notes  


You can’t live something unless you have the infrastructure to do so. Aesthetics motivate people and are part of the discussion.

How do you as a community become self-reliant? It seems to require many of the tools of the new economy, such as new ways of raising capital, ways of funding unconventional enterprises. The community must be aggressively engaged in establishing access to the web.

The new economy will reach a tipping point where it is a threat to the old guard.

Mutually universal equitable exchange is a natural law.

We may want practical solutions, but we must consider more abstract ideas.

Bitcoin is based on our belief in its value. If the belief in a currency is broken, its value is gone.

We are believers, which is why we’re here.

The basis of the Reichsmark was the labor of the German people.

What are the tools and rules that we don’t have, but should?

We need a New Economy story to tell the general public. We need a creation mythos.

It’s more likely to take root if it’s localized.

We need to look at local rewards systems which work.

Do we actually need currency or de we just need exchange?

Is the currency the problem, or is it the regulations and control of governments which makes the currency destructive?

When we had no bandwidth, the messaging was constrained by the system, the government, the hierarchy. That is no longer the case, but the institutions persist.

Knowledge capital is replacing financial capital in the new economy.

The value of local economy is in trust. Trust can be a basis for exchange. How do we do that on a wider basis?

How about a concrete reputation network?

Is anonymity desired or required in the new economy?

Consider pseudonymity. Creating reputation can foster exchange.

We’re all here to create a new economy.

The American people don’t really understand fiat currency.

Besides just a new story for the New Economy, we need to modify the incorrect story of the old economy.

We all have optimistic ideas of the New Economy, but have we considered criminal use? Does criminal use legitimize currency as well?

Are we mixing causation and actual effect? Does criminal use legitimize the currency or does the legitimacy spur criminal use?

Back to knowledge capital vs financial capital, is knowledge capital really winning?

Knowledge capital has to be about something, such as human know-how. Products have a great deal of knowledge capital embedded.

Was knowledge capital what caused the dot com bubble? Or manipulation? The weakness was due to the process of conversion into other forms of capital.

Why is it more valuable now? Will there always be some bullshit knowledge capital in the market?

Only two forms of capital: natural capital and knowledge capital.

Any knowledge capital, if it’s truly valuable, can’t be protected.

Creating value from knowledge capital requires physical capital and the wisdom of when to apply it.

Tools necessary: Trust – or is it the lack of fear? Two layers of tools? Local currency and long distance currency – as mentioned by Rushkoff.

An unhackable reputation system can extend trust around the world.


If a Bitcoin is half done, can you hear it?

If a Bitcoin is lost, can it be found?

A man scatters some Bitcoin. Some of it lands on rock, some lands on shallow soil, and some lands on fertile soil. The last became a hundred and a thousand. 


Please note: Part I is my own interpretation of the discussion, based on my notes and my recollection. Part II is reported verbatim from my notes, but because I could not record all of the comments does contain some interpretation as well.


Dave's notes:


We can't live in a way that is sustainable because the infrastructure and tools don't exist yet.


We want to be conscious participants in the shift to the Next Economy.


David Armistead indicated that he consults communities on how to become self-reliant.  


He talked about creating permanence of resources, funding non-traditional communities, creating maker culture, access to web.


We need a new economy story - understandable by normal people.  


Discussed the pros and cons of money vs. barter.


Talked about the importance of economics as describing reward systems, particularly if we want a next economy that creates a better reward system.


The old system pushes goods and services on people, the new system allows people to pull what they want of goods and services.


Knowledge capital is replacing financial capital. 


Local economies are built on relationships - it's easier to minimize counter-party risks.


Talked about the criminal use of currencies (legal and otherwise).  Informal economy overlaps with the criminal economy.


We want a market for knowledge over bullshit.


Advantages of knowledge capital and possibly other types (natural capital?) - self-reinforcing, sustainable, can't be protected from others, is transferable without losing it.


We need wisdom = human social economy, trust, lack of fear, reputation management.


Personal relationships don't scale, there are the beginnings of open reputation systems that may help.




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